People don’t like to die

On my mount wearing Banded armor
On my mount wearing Banded armor

Insightful, I know!  Well, it’s true.  People do not like to die.   It’s in our nature to avoid death at all costs.  People in Darkfall really, really don’t like to die and when there’s little they can do about it… well some people turn extremely bitter.  The past few days I have really been getting into a rhythme and coming into my own with my character.  I’ve been taking regular excursions into the enemy lands and doing mounted raids on their camps.  Riding my mount along paths that I know well, it only takes me about 15 minutes to get to the enemy areas.  Once there I know the paths that their newbies take and the paths that their more geared players take to the mob camps and wilderness banks.

I’ve killed about 15 people in the past few days that had a lot of gear and items on them (and plenty more with nothing on them).  Part of me feels bad because I’m really knocking these people down the ladder (maybe several days of work) but the other part of me knows they wouldn’t hesitate to kill me.   I’ve killed other players on mounts in banded and I’ve killed newbies fresh from their starter towns.  I think it might be this wide range of victims that’s causing me some problems.

Some of these people who are dying are getting so bitter that they’re going to official forums and in-game channels to try and do the only thing they’re capable of doing since they can’t fight back: ruin my reputation with smear campaigns.  I’ve been called a “speed hacker”, a “map hacker” (Don’t look at me, I’m just as confused as you),  “botter” and an “Afk macroer”.  My only reply has been “report me if you think I’m hacking”.  I welcome Aventurine to monitor me 24/7 and audit me.   I think deep down, or maybe not deep down, these people know I’m not hacking.  The people who have killed me – there are a lot of you – know it too.

It probably speaks more about the state of the game than my killing streak.  I really do wish that no one was ever able to speed hack (btw, I ‘ve still never seen a real speed hacker) because it’s given people an excuse.  It’s annoying and you’re annoying if you run around claiming “hacker!” every time you die.   In a few days, weeks, or months when I and many others are still around hopefully people will stfu and see that 99% of the players they claim are “hacking” are lagging or just better than you are at the game; I’m probably not the latter either.

Aside from all this hacker nonsense, I’m still enjoying the game very much.  I’ve spent the past few days doing more resource gathering than anything else.  I’m stockpiling resources for a clan city as well as my own profession (which I’m still undecided on).   In SWG’s prime I was the top Chef on Eclipse for a long time (yes, it was an undervalued profession) and really enjoyed building a crafting empire that funded my future and my friends’ futures.   Once Haven has a clan city I may turn more to crafting to try and rekindle that – we’ll see.

  • Enjoying your Darkfall impressions. I’m having a great time in game as well. Please don’t take my stuff.

    k thx bi!

  • Well Darkfall has put out that little note they’re patching the servers this week, and that we’ll see people banned for cheating. So that is a bright light.

    Would you say Darkfall is “the game you’ve been looking for”?

    Everyone I’ve talked to, who’ve played it (in a group/clan) has virtually gushed about how it’s nearly everything they wanted. How great the PVP is, the battles, the ideas and concepts that’ll grow over land and resource control.

    Where are you guys on it? Is it the PVP Warhammer should have had? Is it the game Conan should have been?

  • I agree people are starting to cry wolf, In my dorm when we play Halo on the LAN people frequently ask me if i’m cheating (I’m not even good, they are just REALLY REALLY bad). In general people just really hate to lose, and when they do, they hate even more to admit it’s because the other person was just better than them.

    Good blog, I’m going to try and buy Darkfall tomorrow, mostly due to your impressions, I think this was the first real objective view I got of it, and since I’ve read many other positive reviews, keep up the posting!


  • How many people do you think listen to the people who declare that you are hacking? If its a big issue then surely most players will learn to simply ignore those who yell hackers all the time.

  • Scott Jennings/Lum the Mad called it the “Mordred” syndrome.

    Most people who want PvP like to kill other people, but unfortunately cannot stand the same happening to them…

  • If you’re being accused of speed hacking, it could be just bitter losers, but if you’re being accused of it often, it may also be a networking issue.

    Consider that you may be experiencing packetloss on outgoing packets and you’re just not aware of it. This type of one-sided packetloss isn’t usually as evident on your own client (and certainly won’t show up on your ‘ping’, games rarely calculate round-trip). With prediction code on most games, the results would be other players seeing you skip / blip across the screen. They may even have a hard time landing blows on you.

    Many ‘speedhacks’ simulate this exact sort of behaviour via filtering select packets.

    Given that their servers are in Europe and unless I’m mistaken you’re on the west coast, I would think this sort of problem is very likely. My guess too is that Aventurine has setup their servers to be very tolerant of a good deal of packetloss, because otherwise the game would probably be unplayable for most players across the pond.

  • Thanks for the coverage so far Keen, keep it coming.

    I’m still on the fence (slightly leaning towards a purchase) with Darkfall.

    I love the sound of the game but have rushed into other games off the back off someones (not you) early thoughts of it (WAR) and though had some fun in it, got a distinct feeling of underwelming after level20ish.

    I’d also like to mention Haven sounds like my perfect guild (Friendly helpful community-like guild) – though I’m from England I understand there is only 1 EU server at the moment.

  • For those of you that he convinces, join Haven!

    We’re growing by leaps and bounds.

  • I’ve been called a hacker in just about every shooter game I’ve been in and a fee MMO’s too (namely SWG where I had an Imperial build an entire website devoted to complaining about me – that was an honor) 😉

    I would imagine if the players you are killing are mostly Euro’s, lag would probably make you warp around a bit which I’m sure is not only frustrating to them but probably makes it look like a speed hack to the rookie eye. Don’t fret it, hopefully today I’ll be in there dicing it up with you.

  • “I’ve killed newbies fresh from their starter towns.”

    Really? I understand the premise of this game, but really. From reading your past posts you had to go look for a fight when you headed out from your starter town.

    Unless they were doing the same, remember you weren’t ganked because you started playing the game when it just came out and there was no one high enough to kill you (or the pop. wasn’t very high).

    I would have extended the courtesy.

  • i’ve seen the fourms.
    what they do is put your name in, with a lot of well known hackers and people don’t really question it.

  • @Vort: Things have changed quite a bit since the first day. People are definitely comfortable with the game and there are no truly “safe” areas. People will bombard “safe” areas that are protected by towers from a distance with magical spells. I would say the majority of people have been ganked by someone their own skill level and above near their starter towns.

    The unfortunate truth is that a lot of truly veteran and very skilled players travel naked. They could be carrying city materials on them, or just traveling naked because they have the skill to kill people with ZERO risk – it’s very common.

    @Chappo: Some are listening and believing. I get the random hate messages in-game and the random drive by “gotta love those speedhacks” from somebody I’ve never seen before. I just ignore them and move on. The ‘serious’ and real core community of the game won’t listen, but the masses might. It could be an issue for me early on but I have a great community to support me.

    @Mcface: Yep, and then they take to the chat channels in-game.

  • Good read. I also have killed and felt bad after…but I still looted them dry and went on my merry way 🙂 The thing is I don’t trust anyone when I’m out hunting, besides Haven, so I feel that anyone around me is a threat and if they move slightly out of the norm or face my direction with a bow then there is a very high percentage that I will either A. Run or B. Kill them.

  • With regards to hack whines, it was only a matter of time since Darkfall is a FPS-like game (you have to aim), thus your own skills as a player can dramatically alter the outcome of a battle. I mean you said it yourself, people are getting so good now that they are walking around without armor.

    As for killing newbs near starter towns, my only question is how long before the communities (allies) around these towns start expanding the defenses around them to protect these new members to their communities? Or does it appear that people only seem to protect and escort those in their guilds? I mean this type of community support is the thing I expected to see on WAR pvp servers but since the game had levels, most higher leveled people quickly left their starting zones. With Darkfall, it sounds like you can effectively stay in your starter zone area as long as you wish and continue to enjoy the game.

  • So true Bartlebe…I can’t tell you how many times I was on top of the world in DF just to get ganked and humiliated a few seconds later, waking up naked and frantically trying to find some clothes!

    The thing is most of the times that I get ganked it’s 9 times out of 10 my own fault and that is brilliant. It teaches you not to make the same mistakes. It shows that the game makes you “think” and think wisely or risk death.

  • I agree with what you said Russel. 9/10 times that I die it’s my fault too. I put myself in situations that I have no business being in under the given conditions. It’s like those slasher films… why do they go into the dark garage alone?

  • I really want to try this game now, but I might wait for the trial if they ever do it.

    If they do eventually release one, and Haven is still alive and kicking, then that’ll be a good sign the game has staying power.

    Not to get off subject, but I take it you guys done with WAR for now? I noticed on Massively that they’re merging most of the servers. Kudos for those still playing, now you might have rvr again :p

  • I can’t search the DF forums, but my friend told me that he saw a list posted by some official AV guy of players to be banned for hacking, and he had seen your name on it. i think he’s full of crap tho.

  • That remainds me when i was playing in COD 4, and a noob decided i was cheating (not sure why). after that i was doin g me best “faking death hack”, “trip on my own grenade cheat” and the best “get in the middle of the scorelist hack”

  • I like hearing the evolution of the game play moving to skilled players running around with out armor and still killing other players due to their skill. I have always said
    “Anyone can wear armor and swing a sword and be called a fighter. But a True Warrior needs only the strength of his sword and the skill to wield it.”
    This evolution of course lends to credibility of Conan movies and the bikini clad chain mail vixen killing everything in sight. It’s exciting to see that this game is allowing ones own true skill show through. I will get the game for sure but will wait for it to be released in North America.
    I gotta end this message now, I’m seeing some one running at me with a two-handed claymore crashing through the trees. I gotta assume he’s and elite since he’s in his underwear. LOL

  • It’s entirely possible that some people are doing this for entertainment, but I know for sure that one person in particular sent me /tells in-game crying about how he just knows I must be hacking and how he’s going to report me and trash my name on the boards.

  • Trying DF is becoming an increasingly tempting option at the moment… Pity it involves mashing refresh on their order screen and then hoping you avoid the queue to get on.

    Has anyone who plays had a chance to explore the healing roles available in the game? Healing is always my favorite activity, but I haven’t heard much beyond the generic “There is an AoE heal that heals everything, enemy or not”.

    Also, how important is grinding skills? Based on everything I’ve read, a fight is mostly won or lost based on the situation you put yourself in and how carefully you play – so there’s never a situation where the other guy just does a ton more damage because his weapon skill is that much higher?

    Damn your passionate and well-written prose, Keen!

  • Personally I couldnt gank newbie areas, I try to avoid those weaker than myself… I’m going to be walking bait when I try this game I think.

  • I see from reading about DF I have already thought of a useful idea.

    To be always shown where your guildies are on the map, so you can always try and stick with them. This game sounds like you need to… which is awesome.

  • Its not too hard to get darkfall anymore, I picked it up today with little effort.


  • Yep, got it today as well. They did announce they are not selling any more copies this week.

  • Claims of ‘cheating’ have been levelled against my entire guild in Warhammer. We are good at what we do and it is frustrating to have it eroded by people claiming your wins are only through cheats.

  • I suppose my one gripe is getting killed by someone obviously more powerful than me. I don’t see the point (sense of fair play, blah blah blah). I wouldn’t go and whine about it, but I consider pvp of an evenish nature fair enough. Someone uber powerful newbie bashing…. utterly pointless and annoying.

  • Most pvp games usually aren’t “even”, unless you’re referring to an equal number of combatants. I mean look at combat in a FPS game where player’s skills are highly varied (i.e. Quake 3, Counter-Strike) or even WoW’s PVP battlegrounds where character levels vary.

    What I’ve noticed levels or equalizes the playing field over the years is teamwork. I’ve seen teams with less skilled players beat out higher skilled players because the less skilled players work as a team, while their highly skill opponents did not. Counter-Strike and even Team Fortress 2 are both good example of this.