RvR Wishlist

If RvR had this stuff… I would probably never log off.  (I found this list here and added some of my own)

1. Orcapults! (not just for orcs, fires one man over every 10 seconds takes 5 minutes to set up)
2. Destroyable Walls! (more than one way in)
3. BOs buff or debuff keeps (I didnt come up with this, I read it somewhere else on the VN)
4. More Effective Long Range Siege(expensive stuff for people to waste money on but effective)
5. Stealthers can climb walls
6. Tunneling (slow but safe way under the wall)
7. Way, Way more XP and renown for ORvR vs SCs. (far too inefficient to do ORvR vs SCs)
8. Loot with Procs/Abilites on them only found in ORvR
9. Claiming a Keep gives way more guild XP than anything else by far and generates guild points)
10. Guild Points System allows guilds to buy pve buffs, furniture for instanced guild hall, etc)
11. Ladders (take 5 minutes to be placed)
12. Siege knocks people off walls.
13. Rams provide more protection. (make really expensive ones.)
14. Guilds can upgrade their keep walls, guards, etc.
15. Add more crafting professions to include siege engineers.

Most of these would require enormous changes to the game and some of them would obviously be impossible.  However, if you’ve played WAR and know what it’s like to siege a keep then try closing your eyes and imagining some of these things.  Imagine being able to destroy walls and push through with brute Orc force or climbing sneakily up a wall to stab casters up top.  Or, imagine setting up siege ladders and better catapults – maybe done by a special siege profession or something.    Making keeps more than just a door spank and zerging bottleneck should be a goal in my opinion.  Don’t get me wrong, it’s fun right now but it could be more fun if it were developed into something more.

This stuff would sure be a cool way to expand the game horizontally. 😉

  • Sounds epic. Some of these things could be added without a lot of hassle, such as ladders. You’d need to implement a counter-strategy to balance it out though.

  • From the VN Boards post:

    “Keep Sieges should be chaos! Not a bottle neck fight the attackers can hardly ever win.”

    Exactly. This is why I let my subscription run out and I won’t be back until they make keep combat much more dimensional than single choke point. I mean after you do twenty keep siege attacks, you start seeing a pattern that starts getting really boring after a while. Yet the reality is that most keep sieges often had multiple attacks underway (i.e. tunneling, stealth, cutting off supplies which could be BO-related, etc).

    “Most of these would require enormous changes to the game and some of them would obviously be impossible.”

    I actually think most of them are quite feasible and can be tacked on to the existing system with only a few of them requiring enormous changes at most.

    1) Orcapult – Easy.
    2) Destroyable Walls – Difficult.
    3) BO Buff/Debuffs – Easy. Can be done immediately.
    4) Long Range Siege – What’s the benefit of this?
    5) Stealth Climb Walls – To make it a little easier, just let Witch Elves and Hunters stealth in via the front or back door of a keep. Alternatively you could allow these classes “disguises” (like the Spy in TF2).
    6) Tunnel – Easy. Basically works like a siege weapon placed on a siege pad. Setup is quick to place but first fire works basically like an indirect siege weapon with the target on the map radar. Firing the first time “digs” the tunnel which is a slow process (i.e. “portal” shown as a hole with an animation of dirt coming out of it). Once setup, it appears as a hole with a ladder coming out of it. Anyone can then use it at that point by clicking on it and “firing” it to slowly move thru the tunnel to the hole on the other side.
    7) More XP/RP – Easy. Can be done immediately.
    8) Open RVR Loot – Easy. Have special mobs that only appear in Open RVR areas that drop this gear. Even more so, when a zone is control, have special mobs that appear in PVE areas as well. The idea is that when a zone is controlled EVERYONE should benefit in some way (i.e. special dungeon).
    9 & 10) Guild Keeps & Upgrades – Difficult. Interesting approach with the points though, as it’s a decent alternative to having a keep level via guild ownership. In effect, you’re making a points system like Influence or Reknown Points but specifically applied to keeps. So the longer you own the keep the more expensive things you can purchase and the stronger it becomes.
    11) Ladders – Difficult, particularly because there are no siege pads next to keeps at this point in time, except for the front door pad.
    12) Siege Weapon Knockback – Easy. Although if implemented, it should work both ways. Basically if you utilize an indirect AOE fire siege weapon, it’s secondary benefit is that it provides knockback. So those defending a keep could use their AOE siege weapon to knockback large groups at the front of the keep.
    13) Defensive Rams – Easy. Could implement this immediately.
    14) Guild Upkeep – Relates to 9 & 10.
    15) Siege Engineer Professions – Difficult.

  • lol! 90% of those are in 5yr old DAoC!! Especially the destructible walls and keeps that aren’t 1 dimensional.

  • If you’re going to make it so easy to attack a keep, who’s going to bother to defend one anymore? 🙂

    It’s not like it’s easy to drop everything, race to a keep under attack, escape the opposing zerg long enough to get in a postern door, etc. either.

    Not that alternate keep taking strategies aren’t welcome, but just noticing that this wishlist is entirely from the viewpoint of the attacker. Oh my, imagine people having trouble taking a keep, I wonder why keeps were built in the first place? 😛 (/mild sarcasm)

    Might be fun to give defenders more things to do too. Anyone non-ranged doesn’t have much except man oil (if you’re fast enough to grab a spot) or just sit by the doors/keep lord ramp until people break in. And maybe rearguard harassment, but no one uses siege engines in T4 anymore, they just range the oil and blow it up in a big zerg.

  • I have a firm belief that a lot of what is in DaoC will be coming over the next year or so. I know it’s a shame that they can’t give it to us all at once, but I’m assuming they have to recode a lot of it plus updating all the graphics.

    I just can’t wait for houses. I need that extra storage place. 🙂

  • Sprinkles and frosting just make an underlying cake look good. They do not change the fact that most people don’t like the double-deep vanilla nut fudge carrot creme cake underneath.

  • I would be worried that such a code/mechanic would lead to small-scale only fights, Rog. Can you think of any way they could limit the zerg without ruining the magnitude of epic battles? The last thing I would want is for WAR to adopt a PotBS policy on over-instancing content.

  • Too late keen, the game is already entirely instanced outside of open RvR and that content doesn’t seem to crash, lag, ghost, or have any of the magnitudes of issues Open RvR has atm. I wanted open RvR to work, but I have realized that it will never work in WAR. The zone design is terrible, especially when tacked onto the Tier system.

  • Well, it could be worse. I agree that there is a lot of instancing and a complete lack of game world. I’ve even said that it’s WAR’s greatest flaw. But again, it could be worse. It could be like AoC where every keep siege was a scheduled and instanced event that capped at 24v24. The world could be like PotBS where everything took place in a little instance that sucked you away from the rest of the world.

    The solution isn’t to throw your hands up in the air and wait for the next MMORPG to come out. It’s certainly the easiest way and I’m guilty of doing it many times myself. However, if you do that then you can’t be upset when the next game comes out being exactly the same.

  • I’m amazed how many people are screaming how WAR is not working and that they will cancel their accounts cos of it. Well go ahead, could not care less, I’m having a blast even though I agree that their are some flaws that needs to be taken care of.
    WAR is not a perfect RvR game, yet, neither was DaoC at its release or even 3 months later afaik. I hope that Mythic will do the right things to bring WAR up on par with the DaoC experience, but until then I’m just gonna enjoy what I have at hand, and keep reporting bugs and ideas to Mythic (who actually listens to their playerbase as opposed to “other” devs).

    On to the list of ideas, I truly love some of those, especially the Orcapult idea! We do need something to get around the immense chokepoints that doors and staircases has become.

    But until we do, I’ll go ahead and play the game as is, cos I actually enjoy it tons still. =)

  • “We do need something to get around the immense chokepoints that doors and staircases has become.” – Proximo

    You mean like in DaoC where they have places where Tanks and Witch Hunter types could have a 60 second buff to climb up the walls? Seems like the easiest solution to me anyway.

  • I’m pretty sure most people just look back at DaoC and think “man that game was fun i sure would like to play it again” because nostalgia is our memory of things tricking us into thinking things were better than they really were.

    That said, I think they need to remove diminishing returns on XP and renown in ORVR battles and work on the performance of large scale battles. I have a PC that can run Crysis on very high at 20-30 FPS, getting 7 in T1 ORVR is just friggin ridiculous.

  • I say number one issue is performance in large scale battles.

    We do need something to alleviate the stair choke points into keeps.

    I miss the days when my infiltrator could climb walls and gank people on said wall. Those were fun times.

  • Gotta agree with Artemesia, I think most people think back at DaoC and remember most if not only the good parts, and forget about the downsides and how long it took to get to the good spot.

    Humans tend to function that way, in the long run we remember the good stuff.
    Just ask someone who did military service 10+ years ago, I’m willing to bet that most will give you lots of stories about how much fun they had. But if you ask someone who’s recently come out of service they will focus on the negative parts.

  • I think 1) Orcapult and 12) Siege Weapon Knockback would be a very quick and easy way to change the battle field for the better.

    I’m with others that are getting tired of a zerg vs zerg at the front door. Why not add things to dynamically change the battle field.

    And both of those could be easily scalable according to the number of folks in the battle. ie..if there are a lot of folks in the battle, let more folks fly over the wall and have the seige blow back more folks…and reduce it with the fights are smaller.

    Anything to stop the door zergs.